September 6, 2022
Greatest Chess Player of All Time (#315) | Magnus Carlsen on the Lex Fridman Podcast
Check out the Lex Fridman Podcast episode page
Key Takeaways
- With the help of artificial intelligence, neural networks, and computer engines, the chess playing field is much more level
- How to win in today’s game: Since “the best moves have been analyzed to death,” surprising your opponent is the greatest advantage—sacrifice the optimal in favor of the unexpected.
- In a World Championship setting, the fear of losing is more motivating than the love of winning
- “Being World Champion has been a core part of my identity for a while, so there’s not an option of losing that” – Magnus Carlsen
- Magnus is not participating in the next World Championship because he doesn’t like that relief is the first emotion he feels after winning (rather than joy)
- But he takes more pride in his #1 rating (since the Summer of 2011) than his World Championships anyway
- Magnus doesn’t actually practice chess, he just researches and visualizes
- He is the best in the world at evaluating the board and calculating the next few moves in real time
- Evaluation = all pieces are in harmony with optimal placement and your accumulating small advantages
- Different ways chess translates to life:
- Chess sharpens your decision-making by increasing your ability to make informed guesses in a limited amount of time
- Doing nothing is often a much better strategy than doing something – “You have a choice: in certain situations, you should not try to win, you should just let your opponent lose” – Magnus Carlsen
Intro
- Magnus Carlsen (@MagnusCarlsen) is the highest-ranked chess player in the world, and is widely recognized as the greatest of all time
- Magnus and Lex discuss his life as Chess World Champion, how technology has leveled the playing field, how chess is a metaphor for life, and plenty of strategies and insights
- “I’ve always had imposter syndrome. So please do judge me and I hope you enjoy it.” – Magnus Carlsen
- Host: Lex Fridman (@lexfridman)
Chess Strategy & Insight
- Opening preparation vs. avoiding his opponents’ preparation
- Strategies varied throughout his career
- You’ll have a huge advantage if you have a good opening move
- You would get more interesting (and decisive) chess games when symmetry is banned on the first move
- Magnus has always been bad at practicing chess exercises. But he is great at evaluating the situation and calculating the next few moves.
- Evaluation = all pieces are in harmony with optimal placement and your accumulating small advantages
- Magnus hates when a piece is suboptimally placed and he can’t easily improve it
- If his move takes more than 30 minutes, it means he is trying to find something that isn’t there
- 10 to 15 minutes is typical to evaluate a complex situation – “If I haven’t seen it in 10 minutes, I’m probably not going to see it all” – Magnus Carlsen
- “If you analyze long enough, it’s always going to end up in a draw” – Magnus Carlsen
- Magnus is most well known for his endgame
- Proper arrangement of pieces + apply technique (simple moves) + constant evaluation
- When you control the middle of the board, you control the game
- There is a creative tension between the bishop and the knight
- “They are almost equally strong with such different qualities” – Magnus Carlsen
- “[The beauty of chess] is when your opponent can predict every single one of your moves and they still lose” – Magnus Carlsen
Man vs. Machine
- With the help of artificial intelligence, neural networks, and computer engines, the chess playing field is much more level
- Magnus’ team uses computer engines for idea generation but he personally tries not to because, at the end of the day, you will not have them in a match
- Sacrificing pieces (to gain an advantage a few moves down the line) is one of the hardest computer engine strategies for humans to replicate
- It’s hard to find new ideas that will actually give you an advantage
- “The best moves have been analyzed to death” – Magnus Carlsen
- Surprising your opponent is the greatest advantage in modern-day chess
- Sacrifice the optimal in favor of the unexpected (or what your opponent is unprepared for)
Being the Chess World Champion
- Elo rating system: a method for calculating the relative skill levels of players in zero-sum games such as chess
- Magnus wants a perfect score of 2900 (right now he is the world’s most highly rated player at 2861) – since he can’t really get any better at chess, he will have to completely eliminate all “bad days”
- It’s unlikely he will ever get there, but it gives him motivation to always be at his best rather than just playing for fun
- Magnus is more proud of his #1 rating (since the Summer of 2011) than his World Championships
- In a World Championship setting, the fear of losing is more motivating than the love of winning
- “Being World Champion has been a core part of my identity for a while, so there’s not an option of losing that” – Magnus Carlsen
- He is not participating in the next World Championship because of this. Finds more joy (rather than relief) in smaller tournaments.
- Since he’s not participating, Magnus thinks Ding Liren has a slight edge over Ian Nepomniachtchi in becoming the next World Champion
- Would like to see the World Championship played with more games and less time
- Defensive techniques are much harder to execute with less time
- More games provide a true representation of who the best player is
Chess Variations and Preferences
- Magnus wants to play more Chess960 (or Fischer Random)
- A chess variant where the pieces have been randomly shuffled on each player’s back rank
- “Pushes you to play pure chess rather than memorizing lines” – Magnus Carlsen
- Magnus wishes he could try playing anonymously
- Feels like there is a human element of timidness when his opponents sit across from the #1 player in the world
- Magnus likes to occasionally play chess drunk
- Could be seen as an advantage when playing Blitz, which requires short calculations and intuition (you’re thinking less and have more confidence)
- Although, numbing your mind can only be helpful when you’re already really good at chess
- Juggling a soccer ball (or doing some other skillful sports activity) before a chess match helps him focus
- “It flexes the same kind of muscle, but in something, you’re much worse at” – Lex Fridman
- Enjoys researching and visualizing the game of chess rather than deliberate practice
- Chess book categories: openings, strategies, and history
- Lex: “What fraction of the day do you have a chess board floating somewhere in your head?”
- Magnus: “Probably would be a batter question of how many hours I don’t have a chess board floating in my head”
Chess as a Metaphor for Life
- Chess sharpens your decision-making by increasing your ability to make informed guesses in a limited amount of time
- Doing nothing is often a much better strategy than doing something
- “You have a choice: in certain situations, you should not try to win, you should just let your opponent lose” – Magnus Carlsen
- No plan > bad plan
Queen’s Gambit
- Queen’s Gambit found chess games and positions that Magnus didn’t even know about
- He wouldn’t even follow along with the storyline, he was too captivated by the chess strategy
- The main character’s playing style evolved from aggressive to universal—reminded Magnus of himself
The Meaning of Life
- In Magnus’ opinion, there’s no meaning to life and we are here entirely by accident
- But that doesn’t mean you can’t have fun and strive for your goals!
GOATs
- Who is the greatest chess player of all time (in Magnus’ eyes)?
- Depends on the era, especially when considering computer engines, but he says Garry Kasparov for his longevity
- Who is the greatest soccer player of all time?
- “It’s hard to make a case for anyone other than Messi” – Magnus Carlsen
- The World Cup is overrated in the GOAT debate, Magnus appreciates statistics more
- Who is the greatest basketball player of all time?
- Depending on his mood, he can argue for either LeBron or Jordan
